Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

MBA-PATTO

well during my rainy days i was researching and fixing the fatality statistics page..

I came across this guy and believe he should be on the fatality list as he was using a jetski to go over the niagra falls then deploy a parachute , this tells me he exited from an earth...

please read and tell me

Robert Overacker | October 1st 1999|Horseshoe Falls at 12:35 p.m. |

Niagara Falls Daredevils: a history click here for page
http://www.niagarafrontier.com/devil_frame.html

scroll down to 1995 and you will see the picture..

if so then the BFL will have one more to add making it 172 deaths and he would be number 33 on the list..

Any thoughts

Yes

or No

and give me an explanation

Thanks

http://www.blincmagazine.com/...=Fatality_Statistics
http://www.blincmagazine.com/...e=BASE_Fatality_List

pocbase

Re: [MBA-PATTO] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

I am pretty sure Nick had this in the related deaths portion of the list when he was still doing it.

it's weird, the worse things are going in my life, the less I shake at the exit.

MBA-PATTO

Re: [pocbase] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

Yes he did!! But no one has ever really thought this was base related ...and if he had a parachute and intended to use it off a object , Is that not a base jump?

http://www.blincmagazine.com/...=Fatality_Statistics
http://www.blincmagazine.com/...e=BASE_Fatality_List

Rauk

Re: [MBA-PATTO] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

If he was exiting the earth with a rig on his back and intention to use it, that sounds like a BASE jump to me.

wwarped

Re: [MBA-PATTO] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

a ballistic parachute?

it's getting into a gray area. compare a hypothetical unpacked fatality. say a tard gone wrong. how would that differ from a speed fly or paraglide accident? would all 3 make the list, none, or only 1?

-free with 3-

MBA-PATTO

Re: [wwarped] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

wwarped wrote: a ballistic parachute?

it's getting into a gray area. compare a hypothetical unpacked fatality. say a tard gone wrong. how would that differ from a speed fly or paraglide accident? would all 3 make the list, none, or only 1?
Well the ballistic part is the opening but it was a skydiving parachute, not a paraglider or a speed wing... and back in the 90's skydiving rigs/canopies were used on base jumps back then !!!!

If you are jumping a speedwing tard or whatever and you die that would be a speedwing accident..

If you are jumping a paraglider and fuck up and die you would die doing a paragliding accident.

If you use a skydiving canopy or base canopy and jump from an object packed with intent of deployment to save your ass this is regarded as a base fatality because you are jumping from one of the four objects that people get a base number from..

Can you advise me on the other ones that are in the grey area because i am trying to research as much , but its hard when no one wants to talk...

Thanks for any advice by the way

http://www.blincmagazine.com/...=Fatality_Statistics
http://www.blincmagazine.com/...e=BASE_Fatality_List

themexican

Re: [MBA-PATTO] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

That is a base jump.
He should be on the list.
As for the object, I would log it as an "other".

What? The land of the free? Whoever told you that is your enemy.

If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face — forever.

gauleyguide

Re: [MBA-PATTO] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

People fall off cliffs with a rig on their back with the intention of using it, however they were not listed. If I climb an A with a rig on my back then jump, and go in, then that is a list worthy occasion. My intentions were to make a BASE jump. This guy's intentions were to jet ski off Niagra Falls. I say no.

Don't kill yourself!
1-800-273-8255

~Appalachian BASE Club

SLAMBO

Re: [wwarped] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

How would a Mcconkey's Retarded gone wrong not be a BASE fatality? Its a jump off a fixed object using base or skydive gear. Its simple.

wwarped

Re: [MBA-PATTO] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

in the purest sense, and going back to Carl's creation moment... if it can't be classified as a B, A, S, or E, then it really is NOT a BASE jump.

some argue that unpacked jumps are NOT BASE jumps. they will contend that a jumper must deploy the parachute as opposed to speedfly or paraglide pilots. it's technique rather than equipment that matters.

is a ballistic deployment method really a BASE jump?

Nick's intent (as I understand it) was to honor fallen friends and learn from their mistakes. as far as I can tell, the ballistic parachute guy fits neither description.

you may have a different goal/intent/objective.

being BASE (or BASEO for some), you get to decide.

-free with 3-

themexican

Re: [gauleyguide] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

His intentions were to use the parachute, which he did according to the story:

"His plan was that the rocket would quickly deploy the parachute allowing him to safely land in to river below the Horseshoe Falls where he could be rescued. Overacker did ignite the rocket which deployed the parachute as planned."

What? The land of the free? Whoever told you that is your enemy.

If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face — forever.

wwarped

Re: [MBA-PATTO] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

ps...
there were also deaths pre-Carl. Nick has done wonderful research on those as well. they never made the List either.

if you wish to expand the list, fatality #1 could end up being in DaVinci's time!

whoever keeps the List gets to make the call.

-free with 3-

gauleyguide

Re: [themexican] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

What about the little boy in Chicago(I think) that jumped off his appartment building with a home made parachute? His intentions were to jump and land safely with a parachute.

Don't kill yourself!
1-800-273-8255

~Appalachian BASE Club

illwreckyourbox

Re: [gauleyguide] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

My 2 cents... I think davinci time is going too far. Although the thought of people that long ago pushing gravitational limits is awesome. I feel the BFL should consist of people who are attempting to hurl themselves off which ever "fixed object" covered under B.A.S.E. or not, with intentions of landing under a actual skydive or base canopy. And to start picking it apart and trying to manipulate the situation for entertainment or the sake of arguement is stupid. As well, an unpacked jump off of a fixed object is still listable... In my opinion. Say John Doe goes in off the tater bridge, who has been jumping packed all day, and decides to do a roll over, some random gust pushes the canopy out in front of him as he jumps off and he gift wraps himself all the way down... He is a base jumper. He was base jumping. He deserves to be on the list.

GreenMachine

Re: [illwreckyourbox]

+1

What he said.

Real parachute deaths
from fixed objects,
post 1978

Day BASE 1366
Night BASE 293

StealthyB

Re: [MBA-PATTO] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

Well, here we have a grey area, if you consider BASE jumping to be fixed object jumping, he exited from a moving vehicle, and using water which was also moving? However, many BASE jumps have been done from vehicles in motion, using a means of propulsion such as any vehicle with an engine is in my mind different from using gravity and skis, for example( or a bicycle...Sporto). I had heard about this incident previousley and hadn't thought of it as a BASE jump. In my mind the guy wasn't a BASE jumper, do we consider Evil Knieval's use of a parachute as a life saving measure a BASE jump? I believe it falls under the category of a stunt and not intentionally a BASE jump, so it doesn't belong on the BASE fatality list.

illwreckyourbox

Re: [StealthyB] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

I can agree that stunts aren't base jumps. And that this doesn't need to be on the list...

MBA-PATTO

Re: [GreenMachine]

So its 16 for and 3 against..

thanks for the discussion..

i will leave it for a week and see what everyone is thinking about ..

If any of you would like a fellow base jumper that has passed on in the gone but not forgotten list then click on the signature below and write a PM on that site..

Thanks

http://www.blincmagazine.com/...=Fatality_Statistics
http://www.blincmagazine.com/...e=BASE_Fatality_List

BASE_1007

Re: [MBA-PATTO] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

Almost the same discussion is in this thread http://www.basejumper.com/..._reply;so=ASC;mh=25; from 2005.
Both jumpers have been on the list for a short time in a seperate section of related fatalities.
In my opinion they are not really BASE fatalities.
If we have to discuss it, its not really a base fatality. But of course somehow related.
Otherwise you have to add Jürgen Ornburger? and the czech jumper who fell on the way to a jump as well.
And the jumper who died from exhaustion after a jump from the perrine bridge.
I'm sure there are more.
Maybe we should stop the giving numbers to fatalities anyway.
The list yes, but without numbers.
With the huge grow in the sport we have in the last few years the numbers will go through the roof soon.
Just an example: from April 1994 to Jul 2008 we had 14 Fatalities in 14 years in the Lauterbrunnen Valley.
This number doubled to 28 in the last 3 years...

SLAMBO

Re: [BASE_1007] Should he be on the list ? (BFL)

Why would you have to add jumpers that died on their way to a jump, or from the elements after the jump? They didnt die jumping!